Siman 189 Seif 13 - Part 2
13. Below is the continuation of the seif, which are the glosses of the Rama.
A woman without a fixed cycle must suspect the day of the month and the interval until she establishes a fixed cycle either by three cycles appearing on the same day of the month or 4 cycles with equal intervals between them. For example, if a woman sees on the 1st and on the 20th of Nisan, she suspects the 1st of Iyar because of the first period from the first of Nisan. Whether or not she saw on the 1st of Iyar, she suspects the 9th of the month because that is 20 days after her period on the 20th of Nisan. Whether or not she saw on the 9th, she suspects the 20th of Iyar because she might be establishing a cycle for the 20th of the month. She continues in this fashion until she establishes a cycle. At that time she no longer suspects the days that have not been established; alternatively, if one of them is uprooted she no longer suspects it even if the second possible cycle has not been established.
She does not suspect the "skipping" cycle until it is established. For example, if she saw on the 15th of Nisan, she would suspect the 15th of Iyar. If she didn't see on the 15th of Iyar, she does not suspect the subsequent day. If she sees on the 16th if Iyar, she suspects the 16th of Sivan and not the 17th. If she sees on the 17th she suspects the 17th of Tamuz and not the 18th. If she sees on the 18th of Tamuz she has established a pattern for skipping and will not suspect only on the 19th of Av. A similar process applies to interval-based cycles because there is no difference between them. There are those who say, however, that for the day-of-the-month based cycle the first event counts as one of the three required to establish a cycle.
If she saw on the 15th of Nisan for 4 days and on the 16th of Iyar for 3 days and then on the 17th of Sivan, there are those who say that she has established a skipping cycle as well as a fixed cycle of the 17th (since all three periods overlapped the 17th of the month). Others say that no such cycle established because we always follow the beginning of her period. This view is primary.
What's Going On?
The first sentence of the Rama lays down for a basic law that if a woman does not have a Vesses Kavua, she must observe both the day of the month of her previous flow as well as the interval that was between her last 3 periods. The Shulchan Aruch has previously toldus that a woman without a Vesses Kavua is required to observe the Onah Beinonis. He offers us a complicated example of determining which days the woman must observe as her Yom HaVesses.
Assume that the woman has her first period on the 1st of Nisan. Based on this, since we do not yet have an “interval,” we can only fix the first of Iyar as a potential Yom HaVesses. The example then assumes that the woman menstruates on the 20th of Nisan, thus establishing a 20-day interval for herself. Because of this, we now add 2 more days to those on which she and her husband must separate. Those would be the 9th of Iyar as her Haflaga (which is 20 days after the 20th of Nisan) and the 20th of Iyar as a date-based vesses. Her experiencing a second flow in the same calendar month does not negate the earlier date as a possible vesses day. However, because of the 2nd menstruation she does not have to observe the Onah Beinonis associated with the 1srt of Nisan, which would have been the 30th of Nisan.[1]
If the woman had in fact menstruated on the 1st of Nisan and again on the 30th, which also happens to be the first day of Rosh Chodesh Iyar, she would concern herself with Rosh Chodesh Sivan, because of the menstruation of the day of Rosh Chodesh. If she had, however, menstruated on the second day of Rosh Chodesh, which would be the 1str of Iyar, she does not consider Rosh Chodesh as a possible vesses date. The only time it can be the basis for a Rosh Chodesh vesses is if it always occurs on the 1st day of Rosh Chodesh.[2]
The Rama here is very difficult to understand. He writes”...Whether or not she saw on the 1st of Iyar, she suspects the 9th of the month...” It should be clear that if she does not have a period on the first, she should suspect the 9th since it is the haflaga or interval between her previous 2 periods. It is difficult to understand why if she has a period on the 1st she should still be concerned about the 9th. After all, the 20-day interval of 1 Nisan to 20 Nisan should be uprooted by the shorter interval of 12 days between 20 Nisan and 1 Iyar. Secondly, even if she for some reason retains the old haflaga of 20 days, shouldn't we be counting from her last period, or 20 days forward from 1 Iyar?
Based on these two questions, Shach (30) disagrees with the Rama and holds that the 9th is not suspected if she saw on the first. Rather, she would next suspect 12 days later, on 12 Iyar, because of the 12-day haflaga between 20 Nisan and 1 Iyar. This is the view accepted by Halacha and not the view espoused by the Rama.
The Beis Meier however, responds to the first question by asserting that it is in fact the case that the short interval of 12 days does not uproot the longer interval of 20 days. In fact, holds the Beis Meier, an interval is only uprooted by a larger interval. Thus, the Beis Meier agrees with the Rama that the counting begins from 1 Iyar, but he holds that in addition to suspecting the 12th, the woman must also suspect the 20th. This second date is known as the Vesses Beis Meier. As with the Onas Ohr Zarua, there is a growing custom to be strict in such circumstances and suspect the vesses Beis Meier as well. My own suggestion is that unless one has a pre-existing custom to observe this stringency, one should avoid it and at the very least not adopt it until speaking with one's Rav.
Rav Wozner tries to find an intermediate position. He says that if the flow on the 1st is significant and continues, then one should not suspect the 9th. However, if the flow on the 1st can be attributed to spotting or to the conclusion of her previous flow, one suspects the 9th. This is an interesting way of reconciling the 2 positions, although I suspect that the reconciliation would be more satisfying to the Shach than to the other side.
The concluding section of the Rama discusses the possibility of establishing a fixed cycle based on the days on which there were menstrual flows, regardless of whether or no it is the first day of the woman's period. According to this view, if a woman had cycles as outlined in the Rama, she would establish a fixed cycle of the 17th since there was bleeding on that day in all three cycles.
We have previously learned that if a woman's period starts on a different day than her fixed cycle, she could eventually uproot her fixed cycle. However, the Shulchan Aruch HaRav and Chavos Da'as both hold that if a woman's period starts earlier than her fixed cycle would indicate and if her flow continues on the fixed cycle date, then she does not uproot her previously established vesses[3]. The concept here is similar to that of the Beis Meier that we noted.
In an earlier shiur we considered the possibility of a woman establishing a cycle for the 30th of the month. This would obviously create a problem in 29-day months. Rav Wozner holds that following a 29-day month the woman should suspect the 1st of the following month "as though" the previous month had been a 30-day month.
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